Scott Frank interview
– photo by Chuck Goodenough
I’ve known Scott for over twenty years, ever since he was a student in my father’s screenwriting class at the University of California at Santa Barbara. Though not a screenwriter, my father was very smart, very creative, very supportive, had really good taste and was an inspirational teacher to a generation of UCSB screenwriters. Scott considered my father, his father and he was right. My father was as proud of Scott as he was of any of his sons. They had a rare relationship.
I’d drive up from L.A. and talk to my father’s devoted classes. It was a great thing to do as a father/son thing. It also turns out it was good for the students as well.
Scott Frank has become one of Hollywood’s most respected screenwriters. He was nominated for an Oscar for GET SHORTY. When I asked Scott about having a conversation for this book, he graciously agreed.
Here it is…
FADE IN:
EXT. PASADENA SIDE STREET - DAY
Carrying a black leather book bag, TOM LAZARUS, shaved head,
burly, walks in a hurry up to a three-story luxury loft
building.
On the wall outside the front door, he presses the code on
the directory.
SCOTT'S VOICE
Yes.
TOM
It's Tom.
SCOTT'S VOICE
Come on up, to the top.
EXT. LOFT BUILDING - DAY
Sunlit exterior catwalks lead to Scott's Loft. The door's
open. Tom walks in.
INT. SCOTT'S LOFT - DAY
SCOTT FRANK, forties, a few days worth of whiskers, a
handsome man, in jeans and a black t-shirt.
SCOTT
Hey...
They shake hands. Tom looks around. It's sumptuous good
taste.
TOM
Great place.
Two thousand square feet, two seating areas with comfortable
couches and Arts and Crafts furniture, a mahogany pool table,
and many original movie posters, of DEAD AGAIN and OUT OF
SIGHT, and MINORITY REPORT, as well as LAURA and DOUBLE
INDEMNITY.
SCOTT
I love the neighborhood. There's
writers and actors in the building.
It's wonderful.
TOM
I want to be you when I grow up.
They both LAUGH. Tom puts his mini-tape recorder on the
marble kitchen island counter between them.
He presses RECORD.
TOM
(continuing)
We're just going to be talking.
This is a process book. It isn't
about celebrity names...
SCOTT
...or how to get an agent...
TOM
..or how to sell a screenplay, but
it's about the process of rewriting
and about being a writer. Okay?
SCOTT
Okay.
TOM
What do you want the readers to
know about you?
A long, long pause.
Tom smiles.
TOM
(continuing)
You're going to have to answer a
lot faster than that. Scott LAUGHS.
SCOTT
Well, I don't know.
TOM
They're writers, or want to be
writers. What do you want them to
know about you so that they know
from whence you speak?
SCOTT
In terms of like a bio?
TOM
That's in terms of your answer.
(smiling again)
I'm not going to be feeding you
many of these answers.
Scott smiles.
SCOTT
All right.
TOM
Notice how aggressive I've become.
SCOTT
('intimidated')
Oh, my God...
LAUGHTER.
SCOTT
(continuing)
And all this gets printed in the
book?
TOM
Every word. Nice huh?
SCOTT
(sarcastic)
That's terrific.
LAUGHTER again.
TOM
(into the tape recorder)
Scott's now running for the window.
More LAUGHTER. Scott thinks for a beat, then...
SCOTT
I want them to know...it took me a
long time to get where I am right
now, that I've been doing it for
twenty years, I've had seven or
eight films made in that time. Four
or five of which I really like.
That I love, love writing and I
couldn't live without writing.
TOM
That was my last question for you
...do you love writing?
SCOTT
Do you want me to hold that?
TOM
No, no, it's great, because that's
what it's about.
SCOTT
(continuing)
I want them to know I take it very
seriously and treat it like an art.
And I think unlike most writers
today unfortunately, who treat it
like a means to an end... as a way
to become a director, or simply a
way to make money. I really
believe screenwriting is an art
unto itself. A script can actually
be a finished piece of art. It is
something that is obviously then
interpreted.
Tom checks his tape recorder. It's recording.
TOM
Not just a blue print?
SCOTT
Not just a blue print. It becomes
a blue print, but in my mind I
treat it...I can't compromise ahead
of time.
TOM
Does that mean that when you then
finish a script, that your
satisfaction is there...that the
script doesn't need to be made?
SCOTT
My satisfaction is in the writing,
in the solving of the problems
while I'm writing....the process,
for me, is the most satisfying
aspect of everything. Standing in
the back of the theatre watching a
finished movie, trying to find
satisfaction is very illusive...
it's something you can't get hands
or your head around.
TOM
Is that a result of the
collaborative medium movies is?
SCOTT
It's a result of the process being
so powerful everything else is a
let down, that's what it is.
TOM
But, it's also the thing you do
alone.
SCOTT
Yes.
TOM
Without other hands.
SCOTT
Yes.
TOM
That's what I find, once it leaves
my computer, I have to get my
satisfaction at the point. Scott
nods.
SCOTT
Right.
TOM
Because I can't depend on anything
else giving me satisfaction.
SCOTT
That's true, because it gets
confusing after that.
TOM
Changing pace for a second...what
do you think is the key to your
success?
SCOTT
I've made a career of consistently
being the dumbest guy in the room.
Tom LAUGHS.
TOM
What does that mean?
SCOTT
That means always try to work for
people who are smarter than you
are. Always seek out people who
are smarter than you are and it
makes you a better writer.
TOM
Yeah, but what about the people out
there who don't have that
luxury...don't have that option?
SCOTT
It's a goal...it becomes a goal.
And so if you're surrounded by
people who you respect, working
with people you respect, it becomes
confusing when they start asking
hard questions about your work.
TOM
"Hard questions" meaning?
SCOTT
Hard questions challenging the
work, trying to make it "better."
TOM
And your feeling is they can be
good notes or bad notes?
SCOTT
It's often difficult to tell. A
bad note may be a good note that
just doesn't fit with what you're
trying to do.
TOM
What do you do in that situation?
SCOTT
I, after all these years, still
have to try their note. I don't
know they are wrong until I've
tried it and I feel it go through
my brain and my pen...and then I
know it doesn't feel right.
TOM
Do you show it to them?
SCOTT
Sometimes yes, sometimes no.
Sometimes I feel I have to show it
to them to make the argument that
it doesn't work.
TOM
And if they don't see it?
SCOTT
They most often see it. And, by
the way, most of the time I
probably don't show it to them.
Most of the time if it's so
obviously wrong, I'd rather think
about what their problem was with
the scene or the section of the
screenplay...and say okay here's
their problem...their specific
solution may not be right, but I do
understand the problem they're
having and if I try something that
doesn't work or doesn't feel right,
well then I'll continue to try to
work on the problem. That doesn't
mean that the problem has been
misdiagnosed.
TOM
What happens when you get in the
room and they give you the
criticism and then they'll try and
solve it for you? Do you encourage
that?
Scott smiles, then...
SCOTT
I listen. I don't know if I
discourage it or encourage it so
much as...you have to be careful
because once I hear something, it
plants a flag in my brain and
stakes out territory in my creative
subconscious and I don't want to
write to that. What I'm looking
for is direction sometimes. So,
sometimes, even a bad idea might
give me direction. What I don't
want to do is get attached to
something. I don't want to spit
back something someone's given me.
TOM
This brings up the whole spitball
thing that I believe should be
outlawed by the Writer's Guild if
they could legislate these things.
SCOTT
Really.
Tom fusses with tape recorder again.
SCOTT
(continuing)
We could move if it'd be more
comfortable over there.
He indicates the couches.
TOM
This is fine for me. This way
you're close enough for me to
attack you.
LAUGHTER.
SCOTT
Can't let me slip away.
More LAUGHTER.
TOM
Your career? Based on originals?
Adaptations? Or?
SCOTT
Initially, it was based on
originals. Lately, it's based more
on adaptations. But, I'm back to
doing more originals.
TOM
Do you like adapting?
SCOTT
I love adapting.
TOM
That's a form of rewriting. You're
rewriting something for the screen.
SCOTT
It is absolutely a form of
rewriting.
TOM
Do you have a process for
rewriting? A system?
SCOTT
I don't know that I do.
TOM
Then, since writing is rewriting,
let's talk about your writing
process. How many drafts does it
take to get to a first draft?
SCOTT
Dozens.
TOM
All rewrites?
SCOTT
All rewrites.
TOM
Over how much time?
SCOTT
I don't know, it's usually, off and
on, working on something for about
a year before I have a first draft.
TOM
How about "official" drafts, five
or fifteen?
SCOTT
Closer to fifteen.
TOM
How do you know you're finished?
Scott smiles.
SCOTT
I'm never finished.
TOM
How do you know when to show it
someone?
SCOTT
A feeling. You feel like you've
come to a full rest...in terms of
the creative burst. I collaborate
very intensely with certain
producers I've worked with over and
over. We go back and forth with
the material and you feel an
intensification - is that a word? -
of the process. You feel it all
rushing toward the end.
TOM
An arc of creativity?
SCOTT
Yes. And then you get to a point
where it feels burnished for the
moment, until people start reading
it and you start getting the same
sort of comments or criticisms over
and over and you know, okay, that
part's not done. I don't reread my
own material, which is a flaw. I
can't read it printed out. I
reread what I wrote the day before.
I go through...
TOM
(interrupting)
Let's start at the beginning...you
open up page one, FADE IN:, you
write the first day, what's your
process after that?
SCOTT
I rewrite as I go. I always
rewrite what I did yesterday to get
me into my work today. I'll start
at the beginning sometimes and I'll
go through the script up to where
I'm at right now and then I work
for a while and add another brick.
Then, I'll go back and work on all
the other bricks, then I add
another brick.
Tom raises his fist in the air.
TOM
That's it! Readers out there have
to understand how to do this.
Scott smiles.
SCOTT
Okay.
TOM
Right down to "I pick up the pencil
and I begin to write."
SCOTT
Okay.
TOM
Do you look for specific things
when you rewrite?
SCOTT
Yes. When I'm doing a pass,
oftentimes I'll decide this script
needs to be paced better, so I
think about...
TOM
(interrupting)
So you do a pacing rewrite?
Scott hesitates.
SCOTT
I don't think I do one thing at a
time when I do rewrite. I'm aware
of the pacing and I go looking
through the script for pacing, I
will say sometimes, okay, this
section is very slow. Why is it
slow? What can I do? Can I
intercut here? Can I put some of
the dialog into voice over to just
make it feel like it's moving. Why
does it feel like it comes to a
full stop here? What needs to be
done to amp up the pace slightly?
I may feel like a character has
become not strong enough. The
character may be a little too
muted. So, I'll go through the
script and I'll work on making sure
his or her dialog is more pointed
and their actions are stronger
depending on what's wrong with the
character. I'll focus on that.
A lot of times, the bulk of what I
do when I rewrite - I tend to like
very complex narrative structures -
and so things aren't clear, dimes
aren't dropping in the right
places...
TOM
You work from an outline, or cards,
or beat sheet or anything to help
organize your complex narrative
structure?
SCOTT
I work with from anywhere between
twenty and fifty pages of notes
I've written.
TOM
Chronological notes?
SCOTT
No. They're notes about each
character. They're notes about the
place where the story takes place.
They're research thoughts. They're
snippets of dialog that I've
collected in my head, that I know
have to be included but I don't
know where. And then, what I may
do is organize the movie very
generally, rather than a beat sheet
I'll do a very general organization
- just telling the story in my head
- I might do that in a beat sheet
format, I don't get that specific,
because I've learned over the
years, that when I'm specific, I
end up straying from that outline.
Because I so work from character,
the more I learn and get into my
character, I tend to stray from the
beat sheet and if I adhere to it,
it feels mechanical, whereas if I
follow the character, I tend to get
a better story.
TOM
As you write, I assume your
characters develop over the course
of your script and you go back and
rewrite the front to sync it up to
what you've learned about the
characters?
SCOTT
Yes. I can't go any further until
I've fixed what needs fixing. I
have to go back. I can't pretend
like it's fixed and go on to the
end.
TOM
You also mentioned the flaw...or a
flaw of your work is you don't read
your own work. What does that
mean?
SCOTT
It means when I have a draft, a lot
people print up their pages and
they read them. They read a
hardcopy of their script. I panic
when I do that. It all looks
horrible because I'm in a weird
mindset that is part loss of
perspective, part intense
concentration and utter lack of
self confidence. So, if I go back
it's very easy to push me off of
something. I can go back and
reread pages once I've handed them
to you and you've told me they're
good or, at least, decent. I can
go back and reread them. Then, I
feel safe to go reread them.
TOM
Going a little far afield here...
LAUGHTER.
SCOTT
(worried)
Un oh...
They smile at each other.
TOM
If Scott Frank can't be confident,
who can?
SCOTT
I don't know. This is a question I
ask myself constantly. The irony
is that when I talk to people about
writing, the single most powerful
characteristic of any good
character is confidence and I lack
it completely.
Scott LAUGHS.
TOM
What I deal with as a writer, and
I'm very lucky, is - most writers I
believe have a mantra in their
heads saying "I'm worthless, why
would anyone want to read this?"
Scott nods knowingly.
TOM
(continuing)
My mantra is "I'd like to accept
this Academy Award..."
Scott LAUGHS again.
TOM
(continuing)
It truly is. When I write I go
"This is great. This is fuckin'
fantastic." I'm a freak of nature.
(after a beat)
What do you do to get over your
lack of confidence?
SCOTT
You can't write when you're being
so self-critical, I get seized up
and just can't function. So what I
do is so - is a combination of
things - I get so panicked because
I've taken so long, you know, just
angsting about it that I actually
have to go to work.
TOM
How do you procrastinate?
SCOTT
I read, I take notes about the
script, I do all the other
work...all the busy work...but
write. Sometimes I need to do
that. Sometimes it's paid off that
I've done that. I say look at all
that junk I've done early on...and
I can pull something out of it.
But, oftentimes, it's about getting
me to relax...and then the voices
become more like the radio in the
next room...all those voices, the
mantra that I have...
(smiling)
...that others have: "I'm a fraud,
this is the one where they're going
to figure it out. You got so much
help on the last one." All those
voices retreat like the radio in
the next room and so it becomes -
I'm aware of them, but they're not
bothering me and I can go to work,
because it's unrealistic to think
you can ever completely remove
those voices from your head.
They're there. What you can do is
manage them. And that's what I do.
I manage them.
TOM
I'm more into the lobotomy school
of screenwriting.
Both men LAUGH.
SCOTT
I've gotten close.
TOM
When you're rewriting, is there
anything you have to watch for in
your writing?
SCOTT
Yes. Too much story. I tend to
have diarrhea of the plot.
Tom CRACKS UP.
SCOTT
(continuing)
Far too much plot and, oftentimes,
the mistake I make is I approach
movie storytelling like I'm writing
a novel. I want to try and find a
way to incorporate all those artful
digressions you have in a novel
into a movie and it gets me into
trouble.
TOM
So you know you have to watch that
as you rewrite?
SCOTT
Yes. And I tend to fall in love
with minor characters and give them
too much position in the
screenplay.
TOM
Common.
SCOTT
I'm sure. Therefore, the
screenplay becomes weighted in the
wrong direction and that, in turn,
affects pace.
TOM
Do you have readers before you give
your screenplay to a producer?
SCOTT
No.
TOM
So you make a very small universe.
SCOTT
Yes.
TOM
Okay, you hand in the script.
You've done twelve drafts, you've
gone through all your anxiety,
you've done all your
procrastinating, you hand it in,
they wait too long to give you the
notes...
Scott smiles.
TOM
(continuing)
...they make you feel bad.
SCOTT
Right.
TOM
(continuing)
They don't care about what you
feel. How do you handle yourself
in the notes meeting?
SCOTT
(after a long beat)
Well...
TOM
They don't like the script.
SCOTT
I'm sitting in a meeting where they
don't like the script?
TOM
They don't like the script. Or
they like it and they don't tell
you because they've forgotten
positive reinforcement works.
SCOTT
I think that what I do is at
meetings where they're either
recognizing that more work needs to
be done, let's put it that way.
Tom LAUGHS.
TOM
That's the nicest way that's ever
been put.
Scott smiles.
SCOTT
I'm very fortunate in that most of
the time they are very thoughtful
and respectful.
There've been times I've turned
things in and I haven't heard from
them for a while. There've been
times where people have been sort
of insensitive to the work that's
been done. Most often, that's been
in situations where I've parachuted
in. People I haven't worked with
before. I'm working with new
people. I'm coming in to a
production rewrite. I don't have a
relationship with them. I come in
and I'm doing something for the
money. So, I take it all as part
of the job. My feelings still get
hurt, but it's part of the job.
You still have to deal with their
notes. The separate issue is I've
written a script, I've angst over
it for eight months, whatever, I'm
turning in my first draft, the
studio has issues and what I first
do is: there's always a level of
disappointment, even though you
know the script isn't perfect,
you're sitting there not hearing
anything for a while because you're
disappointed...
TOM
Because you want to be loved. Scott
nods.
SCOTT
Because you want to be loved. It's
a little like walking up to that
girl's house for a date and you're
imagining what it's going to be
like when she opens the door,
you've got your little bouquet of
flowers in your hand and you're
going to knock on the door and
she's going to throw her arms
around you and kiss you, but what
happens is you knock on the door,
her Dad opens the door, the bulldog
jumps on you, knocks you on your
ass...
LAUGHTER.
SCOTT
(continuing)
...and you still get to go out with
her, and she's still going to get
in the car with you and go to the
movies, but in the meantime you're
picking yourself up. And once you
pick yourself up, and you think
about it and become reasonable,
reasonable and creative at the same
time, which are often...
TOM
(interrupting again)
Are you defensive?
SCOTT
No. I can get angry if people are
hammering on something and they're
not understanding me. I get mad
when I'm misunderstood. That
drives me crazy. If I'm trying to
make a point, and someone keeps
coming back with the same thing
that I know doesn't work. I know
it doesn't work and people I love
will come at me with it. Producers
I admire and respect - there's a
thing they just can't let go
of...and then I explode. But, I
won't sit there and explain. I
think it's pathetic to sit there
and say if there's something that
doesn't work..and then you try and
make an excuse which you often feel
the instinct to do: "I did that
because..." or "You asked me to do
that." or whatever it is, all those
things we've blurted out over the
years.
Tom nods.
SCOTT
(continuing)
Now I keep an invisible piece of
wood in my mouth, bite down and not
say anything.
TOM
Tell me about it.
SCOTT
I try and hear what the real
problems are. In those meetings,
once I get past all this
psychological stuff, there is
usually a consistent vibration
about something that isn't right
and you can hear it. The middle of
the movie isn't working. Or they
hate this character.
TOM
It just may not be articulated.
SCOTT
Exactly. They just don't know what
it is that is bothering them. Your
job as the writer is to articulate
that.
TOM
There are four Executive Producers
on every movie these days. Seven
producers. What do you do about
contradictory notes?
SCOTT
It's tricky. You try to pick the
smartest person there and decide
who you're going to write for. And
that's what I do. I'm going to put
my chips on that person.
TOM
Is that the person with the most
power?
SCOTT
It depends on the situation. It's
the person with the most influence
in the room. Sometimes they might
not have the most power, you know
they can have the most sway. It's
tricky. Because, as a writer, you
are perpetually in this position of
having a voice and no say.
Tom smiles.
SCOTT
(continuing)
That's why it's hard to be on the
set. Because you're standing there
picking your battles all the time
because you know they want you
there, and they're glad to have you
there, under the best of
circumstances you're working with
people who love you, but you know
what, this train is going really
fast and for you to jump on and say
we missed the turn off...
They both LAUGH.
SCOTT
(continuing)
It pisses them off, even if you are
right. You have to be very
careful.
TOM
You mentioned you do production
rewrites?
SCOTT
Yes.
TOM
You come in as a hired gun?
Scott nods.
SCOTT
Very different sort of rewrite.
Because you're re-fashioning bits
of something that's already made.
And you're trying to catch the
voice of the piece that essentially
isn't your voice. It may be
something you appreciate or
understand, but it's still not
coming from you and therefore
you're not inside it. The approach
is entirely external. So, you're
reading it and the first thing you
do is very little. You try and make
little changes just to make it feel
yours. It's almost like running it
through your typewriter just so you
feel some connection to it.
I try not to do the big things all
at once. While I'm doing the little
things bigger things start
suggesting themselves.
TOM
Little things are?
SCOTT
Dialog that is obviously bad. Scene
description that just doesn't work.
Tom checks the tape recorder.
TOM
Big things are?
SCOTT
Where you need eight new scenes in
this section because the story has
gone off the rails. Big things are
a new opening for the movie. One of
the hardest things for me to write
is always the opening because it's
the most important. Either it comes
to me right away from the very
beginning or it's something I'm
constantly thinking about.
TOM
And why is it so important?
SCOTT
It's the key of the song.
Everything is hummed in that key
after that. Oftentimes, you'll
write another scene that later
becomes the key to the song and
you'll go back and rewrite the
whole script. That scene tells you
what the whole movie is if you go
back. You have to remain open to
those sorts of happy accidents. And
so when you're doing a rewrite, the
act of writing, just kind of
cruising though it, fixing dialog,
fixing description, doing things
off the top of your head, slowly
turns your outer brain off so your
inner brain goes to work and that's
when you get the big answers. And
you know having read the script
what's wrong with it.
You know where it needs to go.
You've read it and analyzed it and
talked about the third act not
working, whatever. Whatever
they've brought you on to do. You
know what to do, but you don't
start fixing all of it right away.
TOM
Easier to see what's wrong in other
people's scripts than your own?
SCOTT
Infinitely. And easier to fix.
You're much less inhibited.
TOM
Even though you're not in the logic
system of the new script and hooked
in to the interior of the script?
Scott leans forward. He's into it.
SCOTT
Because you're fixing the script,
you're not making it great. You're
fixing problems. It's very
different. When you come on to do
a production rewrite on someone
else's script, you're there for a
few weeks. Most of the time you
leave vaguely unsatisfied, because
you really haven't made it a good
script. Sometimes you do.
Sometimes you've made the
characters better, you've deepened
it. You fixed this or that, but
really, it's an imperfect way to
approach writing to sort of have
someone with an original vision
write something then someone else
fix it. Oftentimes the first
writer, and you're not allowed to
say this, is a bad writer. They
had a good idea, but they don't
have the chops to deliver a
screenplay with real flesh and
blood characters, and real
cinematic narrative. What they did
have was a great idea and so those
rewrites are major rewrites.
In that case, someone comes in for
not a few weeks, but for three or
four months and really rewrites it.
Those I avoid.
Tom checks his notes, then...
TOM
How much do credits enter in your
rewrite?
SCOTT
I don't think about it because I'm
doing the rewrite --- for me a
rewrite is putting on a red dress.
It's a whore thing. It buys me
time.
In a very short period of time I
can get money to spend more time on
the things I really love and I only
do it because I've taken so long on
something I love and because I take
so long then I need time. So I
have to be careful. If I rewrite
something for six months, that's
not smart. But, if I rewrite
something for three to five weeks,
then that buys me six months.
That's smart. Then, it's worth it
to me.
TOM
You're brought in. You're given
notes. This is what we want you to
do - A,B,C,D. Do you do more?
SCOTT
Usually what happens is I'm given
notes A,B,C,D and I do notes
A,B,C,D.
TOM
Even though you see A through L?
SCOTT
If I have time to do A through L
I'll do it. If I don't have the
time I don't want to open those
cans of worms because they'll say
"Oh, yeah, go!"
TOM
So it leaves you with sending out a
script you're not happy with?
SCOTT
I'm happy with the work they asked
me to do. They've asked me to come
in and fix these things and I come
in and fix them. If there are other
things I can fix, I most often try
and do it. But, a lot of time,
there'll be huge more global
problems that you can't fix, that
are inherent in the script.
TOM
And they've bought it...
SCOTT
...and they're making it. If
they're paying you by the week,
they're making it. I stay away
from that.
TOM
Loyalty to the original writer?
SCOTT
I usually like to have a
conversation with the original
writer. Before I take the job I
ask why am I rewriting this guy?
What's the situation? What I avoid
doing is rewriting someone's
original screenplay. I'm anxious
about that unless the original
writer is saying let's bring
someone on. I rewrote something
last year and the original writer
wanted me to come on. I don't
think he wanted to be rewritten,
but he knew he was going to be...it
was an unusual situation and
they're all not like that.
I have no problem rewriting people
who have taken a gig, and I find
writers who take gigs and turn it
in on the last day of the twelfth
week and don't do anything extra,
do only what they're supposed to do
and it's their script, it's not a
rewrite, not a job for the money,
supposedly something they did
because they really wanted to do it
and then complain about getting
rewritten. I have very little
sympathy for them. Because most of
the time, especially a lot of the
younger writers, they write this
stuff as fast as they can, they
have eight other things they're
moving on to the next week, and you
read the work, and I have very
rarely been given a script where I
said 'this doesn't need anything.'
Tom LAUGHS.
SCOTT
(continuing)
It just happened, actually, a month
ago. They wanted me to rewrite
something and I read it and said
there's nothing for me to do here
and I genuinely meant it. What a
great script. And they kind of
agreed.
TOM
That's nice.
SCOTT
It was more about appeasing an
actress who wanted to exert some
power. I said you're penalizing a
guy for writing a good script, for
doing what you asked him to do.
It's not fair. But most of the
time I'll have a conversation and
find out what's going on. The only
times I try and take credit are
those times I come on... MINORITY
REPORT was supposed to be a quick
rewrite and we ended up writing a
brand new movie. And in that case
I will fight for credit because I
wrote a whole new movie.
TOM
You got sole credit on that?
SCOTT
I shared credit with the guy I
rewrote and was glad to. I've done
that a couple times where I've come
on and fallen in love with my job
and in those cases I have more of
an investment.
TOM
What do you think your most
successful rewrite was?
SCOTT
MINORITY REPORT.
TOM
Based on a short story?
SCOTT
A Phillip B. Dick short story.
TOM
How close were you to the story?
SCOTT
Not at all. I didn't like the
short story.
TOM
And your working relationship with
the producers on that project?
SCOTT
Very good. Very, very good. It
was a long, difficult...because,
again, my brain wanted to create
something enormously complicated.
The short story was very simple and
I...
TOM
(interrupting)
I think you won.
Scott LAUGHS.
SCOTT
Yeah...but that became a long
rewrite. I rewrote a lot.
The same thing happened with FLIGHT
OF THE PHOENIX. I started doing
three weeks and ended up doing six,
seven, eight months on that. But,
then left...because I wanted to
make a very different movie and
they started to want to make that
movie but when they realized what
it was - I wanted to something very
dark - so it was a very amicable
parting and I think they had eight
other people work on it later.
TOM
Other screenplays on your resume:
WALK AMONG THE TOMBSTONES? An
original?
SCOTT
Adaptation.
TOM
Of?
SCOTT
A Lawrence Block [?] novel.
TOM
Good process?
SCOTT
Great process. Jersey Films, who
I've done two other movies with.
TOM
You respect the people in the room?
SCOTT
Very much.
TOM
They respect you?
Scott nods.
SCOTT
Love that script. One of my
favorite scripts. I really, really
love that.
TOM
REVELATIONS?
SCOTT
A two week rewrite.
TOM
INTERPRETER?
SCOTT
A six month rewrite for Sidney
Pollock of an original script by
Charles Randall. That was one of
those where we didn't so much as
start over but re-oriented the
whole story, the same characters,
the same story, but told in a
completely different way.
TOM
He fun to work with?
SCOTT
Sidney?
Tom nods.
SCOTT
(continuing; after a long
beat, precisely)
He's very demanding of the
material. We're both very hard on
ourselves so in the room together
one and one equals zero sometimes.
TOM
Your least successful rewrite?
SCOTT
(after a beat)
One that I airballed? Years ago, I
rewrote a movie that's about to
come out with Bernie Mac, Mr.3000
[NOTE: Opened in theatres 9/04]
I was just the wrong guy to rewrite that.
I didn't do a great job with that.
TOM
What else?
SCOTT
THE LOOKOUT is an original. It's
been at Dreamworks for seven years
now. We almost made it with Sam
Mendes, we almost just got it made
with David Fincher.
TOM
Why isn't it getting made?
SCOTT
It's an adult drama. People just
don't want to make those.
TOM
Mature? Smart movies, you mean?
SCOTT
They're very low concept.
TOM
No tentpole?
Scott nods.
SCOTT
Right, right.
TOM
How do you feel about that trend in
the business?
SCOTT
I feel, well, movies on the whole
are becoming more conceptual and
that's killing movies.
TOM
What does that mean?
SCOTT
They're more about an idea, than
about character and smaller ideas.
TOM
They're about one sheets?
SCOTT
Right. Or about comic books. The
audience they're consistently
aiming for is a much younger
audience, the whole PG-13 of it
all. For FLIGHT OF THE PHOENIX I
wanted to do DELIVERANCE in the
Gobi desert. About eight men who
save themselves. They said if
we're going to spend sixty million
dollars we need a movie star and he
has to save them all. I said
that's a different movie. They
can't be swearing, it's got to be
PG-13, they can't go crazy, and
they have to be attacked by a
hundred Bedouins just as the plane
is taking off at the end, you know
all that sort of stuff. You can't
have a main character go crazy.
Tom looks at his notes again.
TOM
Any tips how to give rewrite notes?
SCOTT
What people don't ever ask...and
it's the most important question
...is asking the writer what are
they trying to do? You ask the
writer to tell you the story and
what they're trying to do in that
story. What it's about for them.
Ask them to describe the tone. Even
ask them to compare it to other
movies. All of this gives you
handles in terms of your own
reaction and gives you a way of
talking about the movie back to
them. If I'm trying to help you
with your script and help you
achieve the vision you have for
your script, that's different than
me trying to impart my vision on
the material...and it will make you
less defensive and makes the
discussion no less easy but it
makes it about me helping you
accomplish your goal.
TOM
That's talking about the script
from inside it.
SCOTT
Right. Depending on the level of
the writer you're talking to, you
and I are never going to have a
nuts and bolts conversation about
screenwriting, but if I'm giving
notes to a newer writer, I may have
a very fundamental conversation
about screenwriting. You're only
giving your subjective opinion, but
it's in service to the writer's
vision.
TOM
You like giving notes?
Scott winces.
SCOTT
I'm enormously uncomfortable giving
notes.
TOM
Because?
SCOTT
Because I tend to see things very
specifically. I tend to actually
be blunt. Constructive, positive,
but blunt and I don't like to be
put in that position because I feel
like I'm hurting someone. Even
though a surgeon may be cutting
someone open to save them, I don't
want to be a surgeon...I don't want
to cut anyone open to save them.
TOM
Are you not becoming a producer in
your career?
SCOTT
Well, that's the irony, isn't it?
Tom LAUGHS.
SCOTT
(continuing)
If you put it a different way, what
I love to do is talk about writing.
If there's a way to give notes in
the context of having a real
discussion about writing, then I'm
really happy.
TOM
What's the most productive way to
give notes to a writer?
SCOTT
(after a beat)
Carefully...constructively...
positively.
TOM
Exactly what I wanted you to say.
Scott smiles.
TOM
(continuing)
There's not enough of that in the
world.
(after a beat)
TV rewriting versus feature
rewriting?
SCOTT
I find that TV rewriting is a whole
cloth, sweep all the dishes off the
table, re-set the table kind of
thing a lot of times. I find that
if you have your own vision for a
show it's very difficult to find
other people to execute that
vision, which is why the great
shows are written and rewritten by
one person every time out. My
problem with television writing and
rewriting is that you're going so
fast. There's no time for
discovery. That's why I admire
David Milch and David Kelley, Aaron
Sorkin and the like, because
they're able to find nuance and
discover things that, usually for
me, only come with a lot of
rewriting.
They seem to have instinctively
gotten in a groove where they can
grab those things off the wall as
they run down the hall. I can't do
that. And so TV rewriting is very
frustrating to me because I watch
dailies and say if I only had five
more minutes I could have made an
easy fix. So, it's a frustrating
form.
TOM
Do you believe that the Aaron
Sorkins and David Kelleys don't
rewrite like crazy?
SCOTT
Oh, I do believe they do rewrite
like crazy, I do, but they're able
to do it in a constricted period of
time. To me, my hat is off to
them. I remember flying to
Vancouver to shoot an hour episode,
I remember writing half the script
on the way up, half in the hotel
room that night, then handing it
over to get prepped the next day.
TOM
It's exciting. It's wonderful. I
don't think it's art.
SCOTT
No. It can be.
TOM
It can be. But the bulk of it...
They both shrug. Tom smiles.
TOM
(continuing)
Do you see any life lessons in the
process of rewriting?
SCOTT
I actually do. In every aspect of
our lives, we hit walls...not just
in writing, and many people,
unfortunately I would argue most
people, when they hit a wall turn
and walk the other way.
They're in a relationship, they hit
the wall and they get into a new
relationship until they hit,
interestingly enough, the same damn
wall. Writing and rewriting are
the same way, people will get into
a rewrite and they'll hit a wall
and they won't want to do the work
and ask the hard questions to solve
that problem so they let it go by.
They write another script...which
suffers from the same problem. And
they may write a dozen scripts
which all suffer from the same
problem. Because they haven't
learned the most invaluable lesson
which is, that if you break through
the wall, if you sit there and
throw yourself at it, and it may
take months, you may feel horrible,
you may be utterly, completely
disenfranchised by the process, but
you end up getting through that
wall as weak as you are in front of
the wall, you're so much stronger
on the other side. You've become a
new person because you realize
you've gotten through and you're
reinspired by the material and it
gives you new energy and it makes
the whole script jump a level.
TOM
But I find I make the same writing
mistakes over and over and that's
what rewriting is for.
SCOTT
Yes.
TOM
I am who I am as a writer...in
large part. I write the same
flawed work every time.
SCOTT
But you work through it every time.
TOM
Right. That's what rewriting is
all about.
SCOTT
Right.
TOM
Rewriting gets you beyond yourself.
SCOTT
Yes. What's sad is that people are
oftentimes rewritten because they
run out of gas...they got it almost
up the hill, but they're so
exhausted getting to where they've
gotten, that either the people
around them don't know how to
reinspire them and give them the
necessary confidence and Power Bars
to get them up the hill, then
someone like me comes in to do that
last push which is the most
enjoyable form of rewriting.
TOM
The big stuff's been done?
Scott smiles.
SCOTT
Exactly. It's done. And each
successive rewrite gets easier and
you can feed yourself knowing
you're getting closer. You're
never done. If you tell yourself
you're done, you're going to get
defensive and miserable in the
room. You're never done.
Tom nods.
TOM
That's smart.
SCOTT
You can say you're closer each time
you've done a rewrite. You can
feel it getting closer. Sometimes
you go off on an utterly different
direction that is wrong. But you
needed to go off in that direction.
It was useful time spent because
you end up taking a hundred steps
forward from there.
Sometimes you have to do this in
order to see the right way.
TOM
My point to the readers is none of
this is wrong.
SCOTT
That's right...or time wasted. You
can throw away all of it, but
something is happening internally.
I may spend a year on something and
do all the good writing in the last
month. But they wouldn't have come
in the last month if I hadn't done
all of the good work eleven months
prior.
TOM
Lots of students tell me they're
afraid if they think about it too
much or put too much in the
outline, there'll be nothing else
to do. It's not true.
Scott shakes his head.
SCOTT
It's just not. I keep notebooks on
all my scripts...ideas, everything.
There's a pragmatic side to it and
then there's the subconscious side
to it. The pragmatic side is all
about organizing. I'm going to
organize the material. I'm going
to organize my process. All of
that is just making yourself
available for inspiration.
TOM
Inspiration? Hard work? Same
thing.
Scott shakes his head again.
SCOTT
No, hard work is what you do
between inspiration.
Tom smiles.
SCOTT
(continuing)
Inspiration is that moment that
happens for thirty seconds a week
where you're not even aware of what
you're writing and it presents you
with this big ball of dough and you
put that ball of dough down and
then inspiration fades and you roll
out that ball of dough...and then
the work comes. I think
inspiration and hard work go hand
in hand.
TOM
Writer's block?
SCOTT
A very horrible thing. It happens
very rarely. I believe we get
stuck all the time. But, writer's
block is literally the absence of
Idea...period. Utter creative
impotence.
TOM
Have you been there?
SCOTT
No...luckily. But I have been
stuck. Monumentally stuck.
TOM
What do you do?
SCOTT
Exactly what feels wrong. I back
off. I stop trying to solve the
problem. It feels utterly
irresponsible, but it's actually
the healthiest thing to do, I
think, for me, I back off...and
read.
TOM
And fill yourself back up again?
Scott nods.
SCOTT
I read things that make me feel
good or inspire me.
Or read people I wish I wrote like.
I don't read classics.
TOM
Do you read screenplays?
SCOTT
No, I don't read screenplays.
TOM
Do you ever read screenplays?
SCOTT
As little as possible. I can think
of nothing worse than reading
screenplays.
TOM
Because?
SCOTT
Because I find them so
unsatisfying. I believe you cannot
be a writer without being a reader.
It is impossible. You can be a
very shallow writer who copies
other movies.
TOM
What about the writers who don't
write? They just talk about
writing...and don't. Or they only
write when they're getting paid.
Are they writers?
SCOTT
These are not writers. Writers
have to write. Real writers have
to write. There's a whole school
now of geek writers, where you
don't read, you just watch a lot of
movies, and you write influenced by
the movies, and there's passion
there, but it's a cobbling of other
movie ideas - Quentin Tarantino -
he does it in an original way.
They're only so deep.
If you read novels, real books,
read about what character is and go
down deep, then you learn about
motivation and you can ask the
fundamental question about your
character which is "what do they
want?" You can write pages about
what they want, because you know
what they don't want. And what
they're afraid of. Without reading
I don't know how you arrive at any
kind of understanding, I just don't
know.
TOM
What writers do you like?
SCOTT
Right now. I love Pete Dexter. I
read a lot of different people, it
just depends.
Tom LAUGHS.
TOM
When you get to heaven, if there's
a heaven, what do you want God to
say?
Scott laughs an acknowledging laugh.
SCOTT
"You're a good writer."
TOM
"Here are the rewrite notes."
SCOTT
"Here's your second act." They both
LAUGH.
TOM
Anything else you want to add to
this before we call it a day?
SCOTT
The reason a book like this is
important is because rewriting is
the single most important aspect of
writing. The idea for something is
the easiest part of writing. An
idea is just the excuse to do the
hard work that follows.
The writing of something is where
all the work comes from. The
rewriting is where you make all
those discoveries. You write your
first draft, it may take a long
time, you're just getting through
the obvious, getting through the
topsoil. When you rewrite, that's
when you make all the discoveries,
that's when all the happy accidents
happen. And that's what good
writing is...happy accidents. And
then you react to those happy
accidents. You contort the
narrative to allow this new notion
you got from falling in a hole by
accident and that only comes from
rewriting.
TOM
Spending the time.
Scott nods.
SCOTT
Spending the time.
TOM
The readers in this book will read
two very similar views on
rewriting. Which is really a good
thing and interesting and a
surprise. I didn't realize we were
so on the same page.
SCOTT
You taught me how to write. It is
written.
They both LAUGH.
SCOTT
(continuing)
Sorry.
TOM
It's true. We're both process
people.
SCOTT
Yes.
TOM
That's real interesting.
SCOTT
And that's where the gold comes
from.
TOM
And that's where the fun comes
from.
SCOTT
Yes. The satisfaction.
TOM
And the love of doing it.
Scott smiles and nods.
TOM
(continuing)
This was great.
SCOTT
It was fun.
TOM
You were very generous with your
head. Thanks.
Tom and Scott man hug and Tom exits.
FADE OUT.
I e-mailed Scott that night and thanked him for the wonderful
conversation. I told him he handled himself so well on so
many levels that my father would have been totally proud.
He e-mailed me back and said he read the e-mail over and over
again.
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